Stat caps

[Eltharion]

did they fix this? I am confused as to what it is exactly, but i keep hearing that in theory the race with the lowest Str and stamina would be the best in the long run, or the race with the lowest agillity would be the bes in the long run for rogue/hunter. Is this true? and could you explain.

[Karza]

Thought behind the Theory to the best of my knowledge around HP and Mana:

1. You do not receive any bonuses from the stats you get as you level. i.e. You get a standard amount of HP when you level. The +1 STA you get as you level does not add your HP total. Same with INT and Mana

2. You do receive HP and Mana bonuses from Stats you gain from items. i.e. You will receive extra HP from an item that has +1 STA. Same with Mana and + INT

3. Classes all receive the same +STA or +INT as they level regardless of race. (i.e. Dwarf Warrior gains same +STA as a Night Elf Warrior from level 1-60.)

Given the above, in the presence of Hard stat Caps, it is possible for characters with lower starting stats to actually have more HP or Mana than another character if they both have reached the hard cap.

For example, lets assume the hard cap on STA is 300 and that you get 10 HP for each point of STA from items. (Just random numbers. Can't remember actual numbers.) A Night Elf has starting STA at 21, a Dwarf of 25. If both reach a hard cap of 300 STA, the NE would have 40 more HP than the Dwarf. (4 x 10 = 40)

(That's the LONG description and yes I'm very bored here at work. ;) )

To the best of my knowledge Blizzard's stance on this is currently working as intended.

[Grombar]

1) Is it confirmed that there are hard stat caps? I wasn't aware that there actually were...

2) Don't different races also start with different amounts of HP? So in your example the Dwarf might actually START with more HP, evening things out at the end?

Honestly, this whole "stats from leveling don't give you HP/MP" thing is a little strange. Let me ask this: Has anyone ever gained a level in which you got LESS HP/MP than the amount of stamina/int would have given you? i.e., has anyone had a level in which they gained X stamina, but less than 10X hitpoints? If not, then I'd just pretend that stats DO give you HP/MP... and you get a random little bonus each level =).

[Karza]

1) Is it confirmed that there are hard stat caps? I wasn't aware that there actually were...

I do not know one way or another. I never made it to 60 on either of the CB servers when I beta tested.


2) Don't different races also start with different amounts of HP? So in your example the Dwarf might actually START with more HP, evening things out at the end?

I'm still at work, but as soon as I get home I'll create a NE and Dwarf Warrior and check their starting HP stats.


Honestly, this whole "stats from leveling don't give you HP/MP" thing is a little strange. Let me ask this: Has anyone ever gained a level in which you got LESS HP/MP than the amount of stamina/int would have given you? i.e., has anyone had a level in which they gained X stamina, but less than 10X hitpoints? If not, then I'd just pretend that stats DO give you HP/MP... and you get a random little bonus each level =).

Blizzard has confirmed that the HP/Mana increases are indeed static and completely unrelated to the stats you receive when you level.

https://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?FN=wow-general&T=390967&P=1

[Grombar]

Blizzard has confirmed that the HP/Mana increases are indeed static and completely unrelated to the stats you receive when you level.


Yes, but the HP/Mana increases you receive when you level are ALSO static. So debating whether or not Stam/Int is "giving you HP/MP on level up" is really just arguing semantics, AS LONG AS you always get at least as many HP/MP as the Stam/Int would have given you. =)

Honestly, I get the impression that this whole thing is just a huge bit of miscommunication between the developers and the community reps. Really, though, who cares? You get as much HP per level up as you get, what does it matter whether it's "from your stam" or just because you've leveled...

[Karza]

OK, so a Night Elf Warrior starts out with 50 HP and a Dwarf Warrior starts out with 90 HP. (OK, so my guess of 10 HP per +STA was correct. I'm sure I probably read that somewhere.) So, even if there are stat caps, the above theory is indeed FALSE. The NE will never pass the Dwarf if they both have capped STA because you do get HP from your starting stats.


Yes, but the HP/Mana increases you receive when you level are ALSO static. So debating whether or not Stam/Int is "giving you HP/MP on level up" is really just arguing semantics, AS LONG AS you always get at least as many HP/MP as the Stam/Int would have given you. =)

This has been proven. One of the best examples was, a Rogue got + 17 HP and +1 STA at one level and +17 HP but no + STA on the next level. There is no confustion about this issue. You do not get HP/MP from your stats from leveling.

[Grombar]

This has been proven. One of the best examples was, a Rogue got + 17 HP and +1 STA at one level and +17 HP but no + STA on the next level. There is no confustion about this issue. You do not get HP/MP from your stats from leveling.

What if one level they got 7 bonus HP from leveling, and the other one they got 17 bonus HP? Then it would work out to 10HP per stam, just like it should be. I'll repeat: As long as the HP gained each level is >= 10xStam, then there is NO WAY to tell if you're actually "Getting HP from stamina."

Also, since the starting HP difference between the dwarf and NE was exactly equal to the HP difference that would be caused by Stam, that just lends further evidence to the theory that this is all just one big miscommunication =)

[neurotic]

What if one level they got 7 bonus HP from leveling, and the other one they got 17 bonus HP? Then it would work out to 10HP per stam, just like it should be. I'll repeat: As long as the HP gained each level is >= 10xStam, then there is NO WAY to tell if you're actually "Getting HP from stamina."


Whats the point with "what if" that doesn't actually reflect reality? The HP gained per level is not, has never been and never will be related to the Stamina gotten. We already know this, why debate it?

[Grombar]

Heh... I think somewhere along the line I forgot to include my point =).

All I was trying to get across was that this whole "no HP from stam" issue has absolutely no bearing on possible maximum HP. It only has to do with starting stats and starting HP, since all races of the same class get the same HP when they level.

[neurotic]

Fair enough, I can agree with that ;)

[Palmen]

Imo its BS. a dwarf warrior should have more HP the a NE warrior at lvl 60, becous the dwarf is a Hardcore HP machine warrior, and the NE warrior is more the Fast and agile warrior type (well thats the way it should be).

So if you want the evad/crit warrior you should go NE and if you want the HP machine you should go dwarf and if you want the "a little bit of everything" warrior you go Human... Thats not the way it works now, and thats a bit sad imo

Its kinda strange that a Skeleton have the same amunt of HP as a big bad orc.

but thats only my 2 cents.

[Lustt]

agreed, they talk about realism and "immersion" in every aspect of their decisions...i.e naming policy etc. Yet when the basic fundamentals are actually looked at, they are completely different to all previous lineage of the game. As you say, dwarf warrior should blatantly have more HP than a NE, with the night elf being more agile.

So, they may as well talk about " i|V| 3 R 5 1 0 |\|"

[Ei]

agree !
First blizz should balance the Caster -> Melee ( especially Warrior) base hp issue.
ANd yes a dwarf warrior should be the hp machine :D
The whole stat increase on lvl and base stat thing needs some work.