How good is +defense?

[Zuberi]

I've been assuming +defense is better than most other defensive stats (AC/Sta) for a warrior, and I'm pretty much a full on def whore-- +60 at level 58. I wasn't in beta, though, and I'm wondering if there was some sort of consensus on how much AC/Sta a point of +defense is worth. Do any of you guys know about this?

[Firecrak]

+1 def at 60 is 0.4% chance to dodge IIRC.

[Matkun]

+1 def is 0.04% dodge, Parry and Block if you use a shield.
So your +60 def is +2.4% chance to dodge, parry and block.

It only applies in PvE also.

Def skill is completely useless in PvP.

[neurotic]

So more precisely spoken, it's utterly useless...

[Zuberi]

Thanks for the info. Not applying in PVP is pretty retarded, as is not affecting the mob's miss rates. Any other modifiers that don't apply in PVP? Also, do agi based dodge/parry modifiers work in PVP?

[neurotic]

Dodge, Block, Crit and stuff like that applies in PvP. The part that doens't apply is just the Weapon skill versus Defense for hit/miss. You can pick up a weapon you have 1 skill in, and it will function in PvP. Not 100% sure if this is intended or not, but I would presume it is.

[dr_AllCOM3]

so an ork has no use for his +5 axe skill in pvp? or will he hit a tad better?

[fer]

+5 means he will hit one level harder (+5 = one level)

[Firecrak]

+crit chance also.

[dr_AllCOM3]

I thought weaponskill is for to-hit (and dmg, yes).

[neurotic]

It has no effect what so ever on PvP.
In terms of PvE, it will only increase the Chance to Hit as far as I've understood. Damage is based on Power, and crit chance is based on - well crit chance. Now if someone can documente differently, I won't argue :)

[Sintor]

Over the course of a thousand or more swings a day, my DPS calc records a 2% modified critical chance with +5 axe. It is not displayed on mouse-over in your abilities book, but ever since racials have been in, I have seen a solid 1.8-2.1% displayed above my listed critical chance. This is with all attacks, not just default.

Tested with a max skill weapon not based on weaponskill racial? Within .2% of my listed crit rate.

[Matkun]

Over the course of a thousand or more swings a day, my DPS calc records a 2% modified critical chance with +5 axe. It is not displayed on mouse-over in your abilities book, but ever since racials have been in, I have seen a solid 1.8-2.1% displayed above my listed critical chance. This is with all attacks, not just default.

Tested with a max skill weapon not based on weaponskill racial? Within .2% of my listed crit rate.

Yeah, we did some tests, crit rate is dependent on your base line natural agility (which actually means classes with lower base agi get more +crit from +agi stuff. ie: My Paladin friend gets about 0.1% crit chance more from 14 agi then I do as a Warrior), your weapon skill, talents and so on..

Basically what it comes down to is you have a base 5% chance to crit, if your weapon skill is levelled. Each point below your level's max you get -0.04% chance to crit. So at 220/225 skill you have 4.8% chance to crit, +agi mods + talent/equip mods.

Having 230/230 when your normal level cap is 225, will give you 0.2% chance more to crit.

So yeah, the racial weapon skill traits only benefit for PvP is 0.2% crit rate more. It has no other effect in PvP.

[Zuberi]

Nice tests. Would that mean that +defense still gives you the +0.04% dodge/parry bonuses in PVP, if not any other bonuses?

[Matkun]

Nice tests. Would that mean that +defense still gives you the +0.04% dodge/parry bonuses in PVP, if not any other bonuses?

As far as we can tell, yes.

[Oda]

So +def is not "utterly useless" as stated ?

[Matkun]

So +def is not "utterly useless" as stated ?

There isn't much difference between "utterly useless" and "near useless" especially when the other options are more of an ability that gives better returns.

PvE it's pretty good, but it's not nearly as good for PvP, especially when you can get things like attack power, procs, use abilities or more stats.