Indalamar About you warrior post on WOW forums

[Kardis]

First off I have to agree with your post; I tried playing my warrior and I am having major issues in high-level instances. Now, maybe at some time I will figure away to handle multiple MOB pulls with this new system but for right now the correct strategy alludes me.

Now on to the real issue I wanted to discuss. There was a post by EnoYls a long time ago where he said something like, well when we released Starcraft everyone on the Beta boards said it would be the worst game ever and see now everyone says its the best. That statement seems to sum up Mr. Yls whole attitude on testing his games. This attitude is I am right and everyone else is wrong. Well he wanted to not make the warrior a taunt bot well as a beta tester I am a bug bot. It seems that all they want from us is bugs like I cant complete this because of such and such or this MOB is always bugged and does not react right. But when it comes to balance and our ideas on how to improve a class their ears are closed and they know best. They talk about all we have done to improve the game and they keep bringing up the barrens and all I can think of is that there are more trees and quests now and a couple of more graveyards. Is this the invaluable information that we gave Blizzard trees, quests, and graveyards?

It is just annoying to me that Blizzard has asked me to do a job and then says thanks for your input and basically turns around and throws them in the shredder. It is just like in the show the Oblongs where the company suggestion box leads to the furnace and when it gets cold in the office they ask for more suggestions.

I am afraid everything will get watered down like the rest system. It was a nice idea at first and poorly implemented and now it is a watered down joke. I am afraid that the same thing will even happen to durability. It will become an afterthought and just an annoyance. Something that us Beta testers joke about when we see each other.

In conclusion I really liked your post and I feel that you put into words what I was experiencing in game and could not put into words. Unfortunately you just pointed out a flaw that a guy who thinks of himself as a God made and unfortunately for our sakes Gods don't like that. Anyway I am rambling and feel a little betrayed by this whole experience of being a Beta tester; this was my first time and my first MMO I had a lot of fun playing the game but I feel that my voice on some things was not heard and was not even considered. I was here to do a job of creating a game for people who did not get into Beta to enjoy and I feel that I have failed them in some way but it is not totally my fault. So when someone says wow this sucks why didn't you tell Blizzard about this I will say: "There are more tress, quests, and graveyards in the Barrens."

[Rhaje]

I'm sure you've heard alot of it, Indalamar. But you need props.

I've played a mage to 56 (stopped shortly after level increase patch) and moving to a warrior full time (only because my "group" of friends needed a full time tank), I can tell you that you're right on the money with your post.

Keep up the good fight. You're being listened to, and if not neccesarily being "heard", your voice is out there. Those who agree (and there are ALOT of us, I'd say a vast majority) have high hopes that the voice on the boards has a much needed impact.

[Anonymous]

THe last months taught us that high populated treads about improvements to skills doesnt matter to blizz.
THey dont listen to the majority of players they change it in the way they want it to be. A very little percentage requested the changes made to the warrior this patch. When i remember right the players suggested things like a more powerfull taunt(but still the main skill to get and hold aggro and not a taunt for 1 target like eno explained) and a finished berserker stance. Now we have a mix of all stuff
A bad solution to taunt
The dead of def stance?
A powerfull execute
And a bunch of spells to get aggro based on enos post.

[Jinsai]

And here I was thinking there were enough threads about this already.

Silly me.

[Tyrul]

i disagree with alot of stuff indalamar is saying. Warriors are tanks yes, but not Gods. We have to realize their job is not to hold 5-8 mobs at a time, that was not bilzzards intention. They want to give teh CC and offtank classes more interest in the PvE. I personaly am having WAY more fun offtanking now as a druid, doing off heals, and doing dps in cat form. It gives me tons of jobs to do and they are great fun. Warriors can hold aggro fine for 2-3 mobs, i have seen it done. Archazar tanks shadowfang instance lke no other. That man uses all his skills to keep the aggro, cleave, demo, heroic, taunt and i dont know what else he does but he tanks very well. And when we've pulled 6 mobs, we sheeped one, shackled one, i hibernated one, and offtanked the other, arch a kept aggro on the 2 and whailed on them with our shaman, Goda. This game is now more group oriented. It is way more fun imo. CCers have more work, warriors can actually use skills to gain aggro stead of one button smashing, and off tankers can actually...offtank. I can pull aggro off the casters with my druid easy if we get adds. Yay for group play! He keeps aggro just as well on bosses too. And if he ever loses it im there in bear form to pull it off a caster. No problem there!

[Dashiva]

Yes instances are still possible, warriors and their group members just have to adapt to the new changes, its not that hard.

The problem is when you get to instances like UBRS. Over the past 2 months UBRS has been tweaked based on how groups were handling the mob and boss encounters throughout the instance. There are specific strategies used by groups to overcome arguably the hardest mob pulls in an instance right now. Based on our testing Blizzard toned instances like UBRS and Strat to make it more challenging -under the old system-

Changing Warriors aggro management system, has no only completely redifined how 5-10man groups handle end game instances, it has effectively thrown months of testing out of the window.

There are really two problems here. Warriors like myself who have played the main tank role for years in other MMO's absolutely loved the tank playstyle in WoW, and absolutely hate the new patch which has turned that playstyle into something we had done for years in other games, and never wanted to do again. The other problem is as I mentioned, losing months of testing high level instances only 2 weeks before release.

[Tyrul]

Over the past 2 months UBRS has been tweaked based on how groups were handling the mob and boss encounters throughout the instance.

Changing Warriors aggro management system, has no only completely redifined how 5-10man groups handle end game instances, it has effectively thrown months of testing out of the window.


Your contradicting yourself. You just said blizzard has been tweaking it to how things have been handled, then your saying that it has thrown the testing out the window. Our testing was showing blizzard that it was too easy, that gear was too easy to obtain, and that it needed more of a challenge and group play. Not the godly warrior tanks, while healers heal, and everyone else just does dps. It will now be more rewarding to obtain gear because it is harder to get. None of our testing was a waste. It showed blizzard where they were and where they wanted / needed to be for a longer lifespan.

[Dashiva]

No, I said they tweaked the encounters based on testing we did under the old system. Now groups have to completely change their tactics for those encounters, which means all the testing we did before went to waste, since now we are testing those instances basicly from scratch again.

[Piks]

Apparently you have never seen the AC of a level 60 druid in bear form. They could never be an off tank. They have under 3000 AC and are almost like a rogue tanking. Paper tank :P

The best class to off tank at level 60 is a shaman (I rarely group with level 60 hunters because there are so few of them on my server). I think the whole off tanking idea is just stupid personally because with what I just said the only sufficiant off tank is another warrior assuming all of us here are horde. Since many of us HATE being in a raid in a zone that only needs 5 people, needing an off tank in a group would meen the group setup is Warrior, Warrior, Healer, CC (Mage), and Filler class (Likely another healer) now I dont know about you but, that is just stupid to leave that little room for all those other classes. I say the CC is most likely a mage BTW because polly morph works on more things than any other form of CC.

BTW for those that dont know, apparently Indalamar's post was locked at the 28th page. Or maybe the boards are set up so there can only be 520 posts on 1 thread. Ohh well I was spending so much time reading all the posts on that thread and I am a mage lol. I agree with most things said on the thread. There were some extreemly valid points made and want to slap anyone that does not think the warrior, as it stands, is a broken class.

I am really mad that blizzard made such drastic changes this close to release and it wories me very much.

[Piks]

Over the past 2 months UBRS has been tweaked based on how groups were handling the mob and boss encounters throughout the instance.

Changing Warriors aggro management system, has no only completely redifined how 5-10man groups handle end game instances, it has effectively thrown months of testing out of the window.


Your contradicting yourself. You just said blizzard has been tweaking it to how things have been handled, then your saying that it has thrown the testing out the window. Our testing was showing blizzard that it was too easy, that gear was too easy to obtain, and that it needed more of a challenge and group play. Not the godly warrior tanks, while healers heal, and everyone else just does dps. It will now be more rewarding to obtain gear because it is harder to get. None of our testing was a waste. It showed blizzard where they were and where they wanted / needed to be for a longer lifespan.

Thats not contradicting himself. That is saying that blizzard did something totally out of wack that contradicted itself by throwing months of testing of the warriors out the window. Such a drastic change to the warriors. He is saying what blizzard did in the last couple of months of testing than what they have done now.

[Piks]

WOOT


Hi all,

First of all we would like to thank everyone participating in the Open Beta. The development team has been able to gather valuable in-game data over the past few days. Based on this data and your feedback on the forums, we will be making a few changes in the next patch:

- Players will only receive a 25% durability loss instead of 100% when using a Spirit Healer to resurrect

- Players will now only incur a maximum 10 minutes of resurrection sickness instead of 30 minutes when using a Spirit Healer to resurrect

- Some key buff spells will have their reagent requirements removed

- Changes to Warrior’s Defensive Stance that will improve their ability to hold aggro

We are hoping to get the next patch out early next week.