mages vs. paladins? :/

[Hell]

hi there, i hope this topic isn't discussed to often here, and sry for my english.. i hope it's grammatically correct :D

let's head to my question now.. how to beat paladins?
situation:

me (42 mage) vs. paladin lvl40
so he came up to me with hammer of justice, i blinked away => first fireblast. frost nova, fireball + next blast. paladin hp 40%. cone of cold + ae, paladin 15% hp.

me 90%hp, 50% mana.
=> counterspell (improved 2/2), so he cannot use his self heal.. but wtf? he's using his divine shield -.-

ok for the next 8 seconds i have to watch how he completely heal's himself, and the status then was the following:

me 90%hp, 50%mana, paladin 100% hp, 50% mana.

so, i startet to nuke him again... after 15 seconds I was oom and he got 30% hp left, but with his mana he can heal himself another time..

so i'm with 60%hp, ooom vs a paladin at fullhp.

so wtf am I doing wrong ? and why can he use his **** divine shield when he's silenced? -.-

sry for my language but this starts to anger me.. i can't beat a paladin because he has 5 lives (lay on hands wasn't neccessary in the sitation above -.-)

[Xzan]

Poly doesn't make players regen mana if I recall correctly. Couldn't you poly/Evocation and start over?

At that point he doesn't have his shield (The one that blocks spells at least) and you're near FM.

[Hell]

yes that's correct. I have completely forgotten that I have this spell *g*
well, it has 10 minutes cooldown but ok, in this situation I must use it -.-

[slitz]

When you see him use shield, back off to max distance and be ready with a rank 1 frostbolt followed by your highest rank frostbolt and start the kiting (or time the shield with your highest rank frostbolt). Avoid using blink since it drains too much mana, unless you really need to.
Once you're LOM you should poly and drink/eat til poly wears off (poly/evoc should only be used as the last resort, ie second poly) and get max range.

When it wears off, you wince and repeat your kiting til the second poly is needed, it's here where you use evoc.

Instant spells like CoC isn't too mana effecient to use and you really don't need to use them since he will make it anyway.
Should focus on just using Frostbolt (preferably if you're a cold mage), frost nova, fireblast and poly.

In the general case, a paladin IMO isn't worth it. It takes too long time to kill them, so I just try to avoid them.

[Kintoun]

Uhh seal of freedom?

When you see him use shield, back off to max distance and be ready with a rank 1 frostbolt followed by your highest rank frostbolt and start the kiting (or time the shield with your highest rank frostbolt). Avoid using blink since it drains too much mana, unless you really need to.
Once you're LOM you should poly and drink/eat til poly wears off (poly/evoc should only be used as the last resort, ie second poly) and get max range.

When it wears off, you wince and repeat your kiting til the second poly is needed, it's here where you use evoc.

Instant spells like CoC isn't too mana effecient to use and you really don't need to use them since he will make it anyway.
Should focus on just using Frostbolt (preferably if you're a cold mage), frost nova, fireblast and poly.

In the general case, a paladin IMO isn't worth it. It takes too long time to kill them, so I just try to avoid them.

[kernel16]

To start things out, palys can beat most mages with no weapons, also the paly you were facing wasnt rly good at all if he started out with a HOJ, donno what he was thinking. Not like hes a rogue that he can build combo pts to hit yoi badly while your stuned or a war that can kill you in a few sec that your stunned...

Basicaly only way youll beat a paly 1v1 is with a fire speced pure dps and enaugh mana to keep up with his mana pool + mana regen. Cuz as long as he has mana he wont rly die to a mage, i mean a paly is all about outlasting usualy and there good at that. So your only hope are rly hard hiting fire skillz. Also fire when it comes to dmg/mana is rly efficient, arcaning wont work rly cuz hell heal it off, and you only have counterspell to stop him but if hes smart hell know how to avoid it. Also even if you added those 2 talents, wont rly give you enugh time to kill him, cuz hell prob know about a chance youll have it and hell start healing way b4 hes in the red, so now what your going to silence him even if you cant kill him?

But anyway there is no master plan to kill a paly with a mage, things just happen and youll have to addapt along with em, beside if there was a spec to kill palys it prob would suck vs everything else.

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edit:

Ways of avoiding counter, start your heals early on dont wait for crit moments, asp if you have a high mana regen. Crit moments should be 35-40% hp, perf heal at 40%, if your healing at 35% you have enaugh time to fake the heals, heals to 1/3 casting time and cancel it out asp if you think the person your facing is smart, hell prob counter you or ES you right after but would be too late. Also vs shamans make sure to heal after he used any schok other then earth shock, its the perfect time to heal as you dont have to wory as much about ES. Vs wars its that much easier, its netetr to heal at 50%, and if you see him swtiching stance to bezerker, its a no brainer huh also if he puts on a shield ~_~.

[Crosse]

A quick tactic that doesn't always work is to nuke hard and save fire blast/coc (or if you're fire/arc save that insta cast time spell, whatever it is), nuke him to 30%, counter a heal if he tries that first then unleash fire blast/coc right after a big nuke hits. Sometimes paladins will wait too long to throw up invuln and you'll be able to kill them flat out. In my experience if that doesn't work I'll re-poly (after kiting them around while their shield is up, when i see that invuln shield I just turn tail and wait for it to wear) and burn down again in the same fashion (allowing time for CS to refresh. Running straight at them initially with a coc/fire blast to start the fight followed by a nova blink through them can also confuse them. Can you tell I'm used to fighting paladins who are scrubs?

In short however, with polymorph you should never die against a paladin, if the fight is going poorly, polymorph, /laugh and leave. Their lack of snare is really their weakpoint and it should be heavily exploited.

[slitz]

Uhh seal of freedom?
I might be wrong, but isn't seal of freedom on a X amount cooldown meaning while the effect only last for X-X/2 (or something similiar) the paladin can't use it 50% of the time?
If I'm wrong, I guess I've just ran into a lot of not so good players

[Hell]

Once you're LOM you should poly and drink/eat til poly wears off (poly/evoc should only be used as the last resort, ie second poly) and get max range.

Dunno that you're out of combat when he's morphed?

[slitz]

Dunno that you're out of combat when he's morphed?
Yepp you are.. will take 2-3 seconds after poly before you can drink/eat though

[kernel16]

Uhh seal of freedom?
I might be wrong, but isn't seal of freedom on a X amount cooldown meaning while the effect only last for X-X/2 (or something similiar) the paladin can't use it 50% of the time?
If I'm wrong, I guess I've just ran into a lot of not so good players

vs a mage you dont need SOF, all you need is cleanse.

[Sypher]

as a mage, i personally find pallies very easy... they are way too easy to kite... as long as you can get him to waste his shield early on, you can just kite and CS his heal which should give you enough time to finish him off with nukes/instas...

yeah, they take awhile to kill but by far the easiest class to kite

[kernel16]

as a mage, i personally find pallies very easy... they are way too easy to kite... as long as you can get him to waste his shield early on, you can just kite and CS his heal which should give you enough time to finish him off with nukes/instas...

yeah, they take awhile to kill but by far the easiest class to kite

Mainly cuz like a Hunter class, a good 98% of them are badly played, just look at how most palys are geared to begin with, there still geared as if he was the same as in beta, same goes for hunter, iv only known about 3-4 rly g0od hunter pvpers.