[warrior] awsome changes! [Archive]

Sar

10-16-2006, 11:06 AM

very unexpected....its chrismas for an arms-warrior today: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?0502032135251002002125155000105000000 00000000300000000000000000000

@ trainer:
==================================================
Stance Mastery

Requires Level 20
Passive
You retain up to 10 of your rage points when you change stances.
================================================== =

greetings,
Sar

Gigamo

10-16-2006, 11:13 AM

Only 1 negative thing about the changes imo is the change to Endless Rage.

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?0502302033251001302120055000104005012 00000000300000000000000000000
hands down.

Snake

10-16-2006, 12:26 PM

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?0502032135251002002125105000000000000 00000002300510030000000000000

But there are so much many variants to test...i need money for respeccing..

Ferlucii

10-16-2006, 01:46 PM

Holy crap, awesome <3

Just took a good look at it, and this might be in fact a bit to strong :p

gigamo check on second wind, thats mental :D (bet uro is gonna be happy :p)

keboman

10-16-2006, 04:21 PM

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?3202302035201052002125155000104002000 00000000300000000000000000000

that's better..

Anduryondon

10-16-2006, 04:23 PM

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?3202302035201052002125105050104005000 00000000000000000000000000000

I like the new endless Rage. Hate Timer Depending Fights and with the new MS its worth it now to skill without skilling too much crap.
<3 warri changes

Soruss

10-17-2006, 05:02 PM

Anyone know how much bonus damage heroic strike will get from hitting dazed targets? I just wonder if it'll be worth using in any manner.

socratic

10-17-2006, 11:02 PM

Only 1 negative thing about the changes imo is the change to Endless Rage.

The new endless rage rapes, 25% more rage whenever you swing is amazing.
As for my spec, http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?3202302133201052302125105500104000000 00000000300000000000000000000

Soruss

10-18-2006, 12:12 AM

Ferlucii

10-18-2006, 08:21 AM

I think i will go with something like this arms build (http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?3202502132251002002125155000131002000 00000000300000000000000000000)

Pennyman

10-18-2006, 08:52 AM

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?0500502035201052002125155000105004000 00000000000000000000000000000

socratic

10-18-2006, 10:54 AM

Can't believe no one sees the benefit of having both second wind and bloodcraze ;) With all the extra stam floating around stacking those two talents will be nice.

Another quick question, does applying rend and deep wounds = +8% damage from blood frenzy?

Getting Blood craze might seem appealing because of all the stam and the added benefit of second wind, but I can't see it being really useful outside of a situational 1v1 or 2v2. With all the resilience stacked on warrior gear, the all around decreased crit rate, and the fact that no one really targets warriors, I see a much higher benefit to putting those 3 points into improved battleshout.

And as far as blood frenzy goes, I'm pretty sure it doesn't stack off of the same warrior.

Ferlucii

10-18-2006, 11:14 AM

The new endless rage rapes, 25% more rage whenever you swing is amazing.
As for my spec, http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?3202302133201052302125105500104000000 00000000300000000000000000000
Why do you prefer chance of immobilization over resist stun / charm and enrage? :) (losing 1pt in 2h spec)

I'd rather go with something like this clicky (http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?3202502132201052002125105500104002000 00000000300000000000000000000)

socratic

10-18-2006, 11:34 AM

Why do you prefer chance of immobilization over resist stun / charm and enrage? :) (losing 1pt in 2h spec)

I'd rather go with something like this clicky (http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?3202502132201052002125105500104002000 00000000300000000000000000000)

Improved hamstring is a 3 second undispellable root, its the only way to peel warriors really have. Stun resist is nice, but it completely counteracts getting second wind, I only put 3 point in it for a useful filler.

Lastly, why would you want 2 points in enrage? I'll make the same argument for not getting enrage that I did for not getting blood craze. Enrage is no longer a must have ability considering a majority of the game is 5v5s. Warriors will only be getting focused if you have drastically low hit points, the other team isn't assisting, or if you've already lost. If you get timered on by a 5 mage gimmick group in the arena, 10% more damage isn't gonna do much.

Relying on a random frost nova crit to buff your damage isn't nearly as effective as a root proc off of a spammable ability.

Ferlucii

10-18-2006, 11:56 AM

Good point(s) i have no experience yet with arena's or whatsoever, only with outdoor 5v5 games, and you are right, i did not recieve much hits there. I also do fairly much 2v2 though, and there i do get hit often, so i'm still not really sure what to pick. guess time will tell :)

bierbaum

10-18-2006, 12:26 PM

i think ill spec like socratic even if ill miss popping enrage @ 25% but oh well who cares

The Arc

10-18-2006, 02:55 PM

The new endless rage rapes, 25% more rage whenever you swing is amazing.
As for my spec, http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?3202302133201052302125105500104000000 00000000300000000000000000000

Move the points in Iron Will to Imp. Thunder Clap and you have my spec point for point.

uro

10-18-2006, 09:42 PM

Here are the specs that I'm going to try out:

1. Standard MS + Second Wind, Standard Fury + Imp Intercept, Death Wish, and 3 points in Flurry.

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?3202032035251002000120005500105015012 03000000000000000000000000000

2. Standard MS + Second Wind + Blood Frenzy + 3 IMP MS, Standard Fury + IMP Intercept and Death Wish.

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?3202032035251002002123005500104005012 00000000000000000000000000000

Also, you could I was thinking about the possibility of yoinking the 3 in imp MS and dropping them into TM

3. Full Arms

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?3202032035251002002125105500104005000 00000000000000000000000000000

You could also take drop enrage, get TM, the last point in Imp Battle Shout, and drop the last point into what the fuck ever.

Anyway, Second Wind + Blood Craze is stupid... they trigger off of COMPLETELY different things. Also, i feel that imp hamstring is more of a liability in expansion. You tab-ham a warrior, Imp Ham procs, and great, you just gave him at least 20 rage (depends on if you autoswung or not) and 10% of his HP. Of course, this is my first impression and I'd have to fuck around with it to actually see, but yeah.

Im kind of sad about weapon mastery though, i wish that talent didnt exist. Now every trash fuck warrior who i used to chain disarm and laugh at will be immune for 2 talent points :(.

Ortega

10-18-2006, 10:09 PM

Hamstring is considered an Immobolize whether or not Imp Hamstring goes off so : /. And although Bloodcraze is off of crits I forsee it being much more useful then Improved Battleshout when your packing around 15 k hp and regenerating 900 Hp every time you get crit. I gotta say I too am disappointed about weapon mastery, really takes away the fun from disarming someone then weapon swaping to my chained weapon and laughing at them :P Guess we just have to laugh about the people who think Imp thunderclap is worthless, but are putting points into flurry!

The Arc

10-18-2006, 10:16 PM

Hamstring is considered an Immobolize whether or not Imp Hamstring goes off so : /.

Are you sure? And if it does, is it a bug?

uro

10-18-2006, 10:22 PM

Are you sure? And if it does, is it a bug?

it definately doesnt. hamstring is classified as a snare, imp ham is an immobilize.

Ortega

10-18-2006, 10:37 PM

My mistake I totally forgot our trinket dispells both so I was basing my reasoning off of that. Guess I shouldve double checked, but I was wondering based on the wording is the rage off of second wind going to be instant now and the health over time?

keboman

10-18-2006, 10:37 PM

Is it true that sword specs procs don't generate rage in BC?

Ortega

10-18-2006, 10:43 PM

Is it true that sword specs procs don't generate rage in BC?

I hadnt heard this, but I will definently have to check now.

keboman

10-18-2006, 11:06 PM

Crits are only ~150% rage now since rage gain is normalized.. now AP really is >>>>>> crit and sword spec is even better than axe if the hits still generate rate.

uro

10-19-2006, 12:19 AM

Crits are only ~150% rage now since rage gain is normalized.. now AP really is >>>>>> crit and sword spec is even better than axe if the hits still generate rate.

uhh, what? the only difference rage normalization makes now is like 2-3 rage off of a crit with amazing gear. theoretically, its the other way around. since peole are going to have resilience gear, your crit rate is going to be lower in practice, so poleaxe would be more beneficial because if you dont crit, you dont kill shit.

keboman

10-19-2006, 12:51 AM

Crits generate 150% more rage than white hits supposedly. Not double any more. It's not damage/x=rage, it's some other formula.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=34926496&postId=360903634&sid=1#125

/edit wow I'm bad at math

So basically.. 5% crit will give you a chance to make say 30 rage instead of 20 and 5% sword spec would be a chance to make 40 rage which is what sword spec does now but to an even bigger degree.

Margus

10-19-2006, 12:56 AM

I dunno about resilience yet, but enrage maybe loose a bit because the lack of being critted, but who knows?
I tend to the classic fury cookie cut points, may take a point off enrage and put it into imp bs.
Is the rage normalization thingie confirmed or did you just took too much 'shrooms?

i'll spec like this (http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-warrior/talents.html?0502502132251002002125155000105004000 00000000000000000000000000000)
Classic Cookie Cutter @ TBC :>

uro

10-19-2006, 02:02 AM

Apparantly, you're not so good at English either :\.

Those in the beta right now matching their intended damage output are seeing an approximate 50% increase in rage generation from crits.

That sentence means warriors who hit for the "internal number" or whatever are getting 50% MORE rage from the crit component (so, theyre getting 25% more rage for the total hit). Crits are still double rage.

RubiksCube

10-19-2006, 04:31 AM

Apparantly, you're not so good at English either :\.

uh oh...

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=apparently

uro

10-19-2006, 04:33 AM

OHNOES SPELLING!@!@

who said i was good at english btw? i sure didnt!

;D

Margus

10-19-2006, 05:53 AM

btw. uro, still no barbed choker? :D

keboman

10-19-2006, 08:11 AM

Apparantly, you're not so good at English either :\.

That sentence means warriors who hit for the "internal number" or whatever are getting 50% MORE rage from the crit component (so, theyre getting 25% more rage for the total hit). Crits are still double rage.

http://grig.shackspace.com/ragegen.jpg

According to that they aren't.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=34926496&sid=1

It's impossible for me to play 80 hours a week, so I didn't get invited to beta and have no way to verify.

From Kalgan's post: The amount of rage reduction and increase through normal attacks is in fact pretty small, but the reduction in crit based rage generation will probably be quite noticeable for those emphasizing (and thus focusing on) crit-based damage.

Garim

10-19-2006, 09:12 AM

I know windfury is considered a yellow attack in TBC so that you don't get rage out of windfury procs, but I'm not sure about if sword spec is yellow or white dmg haven't payed attention to that.

keboman

10-19-2006, 09:35 AM

Looks like the era of warriors being absurdely overpowered is over ;/ Maybe other classes can actually be at the top of the kills in BGs now. It's crazy how easy it is to do the most damage and have the most killing blows right now.

Soruss

10-19-2006, 12:18 PM

Anyway, Second Wind + Blood Craze is stupid... they trigger off of COMPLETELY different things. Also, i feel that imp hamstring is more of a liability in expansion. You tab-ham a warrior, Imp Ham procs, and great, you just gave him at least 20 rage (depends on if you autoswung or not) and 10% of his HP. Of course, this is my first impression and I'd have to fuck around with it to actually see, but yeah.

Not at all. Frost nova can both crit and immobolize you, or any frost mage with frostbite . Imp hamstring is the same. Not to mention all the proc stuns. Mace spec stuns, blackout, impact, etc... Another warrior may intercept you to hamstring you so your target can get away. Lots of possibilities for getting crit and being stunned/immobolized at the same time. And they don't all require the warrior to be getting focus fired.

Also, as far as secondwind+iron will. I personally think not getting CC'd in the first place is #1 priority, after that if you do get stunned then getting the rage/hp from it will be a good buffer so you don't get owned. So I don't think second wind and iron will are conflicting at all, they're just different ways to make an ability less effective against you.

Im kind of sad about weapon mastery though, i wish that talent didnt exist. Now every trash fuck warrior who i used to chain disarm and laugh at will be immune for 2 talent points :(.

Definitely. I'd like to see disarm immunity removed from the game completely.

Soulless

10-19-2006, 03:59 PM

SS still generates rage.

And I for one do not have any problems generating rage even w/o ER and I'm using Imp. MS.

P.S.: Weapon Mastery is still bugged, you still get disarmed even with 2/2.

Jerom

10-20-2006, 02:24 AM

SS still generates rage.

And I for one do not have any problems generating rage even w/o ER and I'm using Imp. MS.

P.S.: Weapon Mastery is still bugged, you still get disarmed even with 2/2.

Thats correct. With the Talent i still got disarmed by a mob...

On the other hand ,reading the talent text, maybe it just doubles the chance to resist a disarm instead of making you 100% immun to disarm effects...

RubiksCube

10-20-2006, 03:14 AM

Thats correct. With the Talent i still got disarmed by a mob...

On the other hand ,reading the talent text, maybe it just doubles the chance to resist a disarm instead of making you 100% immun to disarm effects...

Nope, but that's a common thought, at least among Germans ;)

It has the same Tool Tip Text as Cold Blood, it "increases the chance by 100%". The chance is always a percentage, so increasing the percentage by 100% will push the chance above 100% so it always happens.

It's just a bug.

Jerom

10-20-2006, 05:30 AM

Nope, but that's a common thought, at least among Germans ;)

It has the same Tool Tip Text as Cold Blood, it "increases the chance by 100%". The chance is always a percentage, so increasing the percentage by 100% will push the chance above 100% so it always happens.

It's just a bug.

Thats really nice. Specially for the dam Blood Furnace Orcs.

Anyone tested a 2h Build with the new improved Slam (cast time 0.5 sek) yet?

Otzo

10-22-2006, 02:35 PM

can someone sup me the new 2-hander rage genewhatthefuckmyspellingsuckslolandsodoesmymeory i heard? that endless rage is almost a must now to keep up good amount of rage up.

Ralrra

10-22-2006, 03:04 PM

can someone sup me the new 2-hander rage genewhatthefuckmyspellingsuckslolandsodoesmymeory i heard? that endless rage is almost a must now to keep up good amount of rage up.

Endless rage is extremely nice to have if your gear isn't top notch coming in to the expansion. Warrs that already in mostly AQ40 or Naxx gear levels shouldn't really worry about rage generation.

The rage normalization brought the lower end of the gear spectrum up more than it nerfed the top end imo.

The Arc

10-22-2006, 05:49 PM

Soruss

10-22-2006, 06:09 PM

I was under the impression that the purpose of rage normalization was to eliminate the effect gear had on rage generation. As in, you would always generate the exact same amount of rage from a hit nomatter what 2h (or 1h) you're using. Can anybody in beta confirm this or say whether or not rage generated does vary from hit to hit or when different gear is used?

I think the idea was to rage generation less gear dependent. i.e. reducing rage from crits and make the damage more normalized. If they implemented it poorly or not is hard to say because there are a lot of whiners out there who will basically cry about anything that might contribute to their 33%crit and DEOI not insta killing people anymore.

I'd like to hear someone who I know isn't a huge whiner talk about it, or test it first hand. I think the fact that Uro didn't realize he was getting less from crits says something (i.e. other people are whining).

Lodekim

10-22-2006, 06:45 PM

Personally there are a few higher end fury talents I'm having trouble convincing myself to drop for improved mortal strike and endless rage. I like the specs Uro listed with not maxing improved MS and getting death wish and Improved Intercept. After doing some pvp as Fury while specced for PVE, I really got attached to improved intercept, and being MS I notice myself wanting that talent a lot now.

I'm thinking 1 point in flurry would do a lot to help rage generation as well, especially with poleaxe specialization, and speccing 1 there I could still keep at 2 in blood frenzy, or I could drop that and up it to 3 in flurry.

I have the feeling I'm going to be saving gold to do a ton of respecs at 70 just to test what feels the best to me.

edit: While I'm thinking about it, having weapon mastery is a mixed blessing, it does mean that I can't disarm random bad players, but it means when I want to enchant a weapon I don't have to go "well, I guess I won't add any damage to this weapon because I need weapon chain" I've got crusader on my severance right now, and I'm already pissed about not weapon chaining it like I did most previous weapons, but at the same time, the increased damage when farming or fighting classes without disarm or even PVE is nice.

keboman

10-22-2006, 09:20 PM

Your damage with Crusader and Strongholds is pretty much just as good on average as gauntlets of Annihiliation and Gauntlets of Annihilation and Crusader is impossible with a weapon chain.. so it's not like you lose anything.

I personally like Crusader and Death Grips ;)

The Arc

10-22-2006, 09:23 PM

Rerolled a (human) warrior, and I'm having trouble deciding: sword or axe smith?

And has anybody found out for sure whether or not sword spec only procs off of auto attacks now?

Soulless

10-23-2006, 06:24 PM

Rerolled a (human) warrior, and I'm having trouble deciding: sword or axe smith?

And has anybody found out for sure whether or not sword spec only procs off of auto attacks now?

Sword.

Dunno, procs like no tomorrow in conjunction with HoJ, so I wouldn't say it's worse then live atm.

Anduryondon

10-24-2006, 03:04 AM

Axe because i dont need anti fear ;P

Sar

10-24-2006, 09:09 AM

i´m thinking about to drop my engi and learn blacksmith(axe) to bruning-crusade. actually i bearly use my engi-skills, i heard the goodies wont able to use in arena-pvp. up to this i had always bad-luck with weapon dropps (see my profile).

good or bad idea? is there any good engi-stuff on the horizon?

Otzo

10-24-2006, 12:49 PM

actually i bearly use my engi-skills, i heard the goodies wont able to use in arena-pvp.

Need an confirm for this myself too, could just get herbalism myself for farming cash. :p

Blu

10-24-2006, 03:04 PM

It's true!
I say so and everything i say is true.

Anduryondon

10-25-2006, 03:27 AM

Yes its true.

lanner

10-25-2006, 04:18 AM

So you better start uping blacksmith then I guess?

Soruss

10-25-2006, 05:59 AM

So you better start uping blacksmith then I guess?

Every tradeskill seems to be getting some sort of boost that gives you more reason to take it other than LOLGRENADEZ or myguildneedsatailor:(

Blacksmith getting the obvious axesmith/swordsmith/macesmith/armorsmith only items. Tailors can make tailor only nets. Enchanters get special enchants. Herbalist can gather special buffs from plants or something (shakey on this one). I have a feeling that maybe miners will be able to get gems for socketing or something of that sort.