Rogue PvP build

[Filth]

Hello Nurfed,

I was wondering if anyone who played rogue to high lvl and got a lot of pvp experience would take a look at this build i made...

Any ways of improving it would be great :)


Class: Rogue
Level: 60


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Assassination Talents (15 points)


Malice - 5/5 points
Increases your critical strike chance by 5%.


Murder - 2/2 points
Increases your chance to hit while using your Sap, Ambush, Garrote, or Cheap Shot abilities by 5%.


Improved Slice and Dice - 3/3 points
Increases the duration of your Slice and Dice ability by 45%.


Lethality - 5/5 points
Increases the critical strike damage bonus of your Sinister Strike, Gouge, Backstab, Ambush, Ghostly Strike, or Hemorrhage ability by 30%.



Combat Talents (22 points)


Lightning Reflexes - 5/5 points
Increases your Dodge chance by 5%.


Deflection - 5/5 points
Increases your Parry chance by 5%.


Precision - 1/5 point
Increases your chance to hit with melee weapons by 1%.


Improved Sprint - 3/3 points
Reduces the cooldown of your Sprint ability by 90 seconds.


Riposte - 1/1 point
A strike that becomes active after parrying an opponent's attack. This attack deals 150% weapon damage and disarms the target for 6 seconds.


Dagger Specialization - 5/5 points
Increases your chance to get a critical strike with Daggers by 5%.


Improved Kick - 1/2 point
Gives your Kick ability a 50% chance to silence the target for 2 seconds.


Blade Flurry - 1/1 point
Increases your attack speed by 20%. In addition, attacks strike an additional nearby opponent. Lasts 15 seconds.



Subtlety Talents (14 points)


Camouflage - 5/5 points
Increases your speed while stealthed by 15%.


Opportunity - 5/5 points
Increases the damage dealt when striking from behind with your Backstab, Garrote, or Ambush abilities by 20%.


Improved Ambush - 3/3 points
Increases the critical strike chance of your Ambush ability by 40%.


Ghostly Strike - 1/1 point
A strike that deals 125% weapon damage and increases your chance to dodge by 15% for 7 seconds. Awards 1 combo point.

thanx in advance,

-Filth

[Iscariot]

Alot of the talents you've chosen don't have an active impact on your character for pvp. I'll list a couple that I think you should reconsider and a few reasons why.

First up, Improved Slice and Dice. Slice and Dice looks good on paper, but as a Rogue your damage comes from your special attacks, ie. Sinister Strike, Evicerate, Ambush, ect. Hasting your normal attacks, esepcially in pvp, is a waste of combo points. I'd definately put these points elsewhere.

Second, Improved Sprint. While Sprint is very helpful, knocking down from 5 minutes to 3.5 isn't giving you any real pvp edge. This is much too passive for a pvp rogue and adds nothing to your character.

Ghostly Strike, yet another ability that looks good on paper, but isn't really that practical. I'm a Combat-heavy rogue and I had Ghostly Strike for a while. Its biggest drawbacks are a relatively low damage and high energy cost. Damage is 125% and energy cost is 50. The added dodge chance is nice, but this really is more of a pve ability, as you want to be pouring out damage on your target, not marginally improving your dodge.

You've really spread out along all three trees and I believe you're missing out on some of the great talents rogue has to offer. I'd advise reading Kintouns outlines in the sticky. You should narrow your focus and decide what you want to be. I personally go for a Combat toe-to-toe rogue. It works great againts other rogues and gives me a fighting chance against hard targets without sacrificing too much burst damage vs soft ones.

Hope this helps a bit,
Iscariot

[Filth]

First up, Improved Slice and Dice. Slice and Dice looks good on paper, but as a Rogue your damage comes from your special attacks, ie. Sinister Strike, Evicerate, Ambush, ect. Hasting your normal attacks, esepcially in pvp, is a waste of combo points. I'd definately put these points elsewhere.

I see, so lets take those 3 points out of slice and save them for a bit (re making template as i write this to bare with me :) )


Second, Improved Sprint. While Sprint is very helpful, knocking down from 5 minutes to 3.5 isn't giving you any real pvp edge. This is much too passive for a pvp rogue and adds nothing to your character.

Yea, i was kinda unsure about Sprint, so if i move those 3 over into Improved Backstab i guess that would be a wise call?



Ghostly Strike, yet another ability that looks good on paper, but isn't really that practical. I'm a Combat-heavy rogue and I had Ghostly Strike for a while. Its biggest drawbacks are a relatively low damage and high energy cost. Damage is 125% and energy cost is 50. The added dodge chance is nice, but this really is more of a pve ability, as you want to be pouring out damage on your target, not marginally improving your dodge.

aha, well... its gone then.... nothing down that line i thought was worth going for anyway so thats another point saved...



You've really spread out along all three trees and I believe you're missing out on some of the great talents rogue has to offer. I'd advise reading Kintouns outlines in the sticky. You should narrow your focus and decide what you want to be. I personally go for a Combat toe-to-toe rogue. It works great againts other rogues and gives me a fighting chance against hard targets without sacrificing too much burst damage vs soft ones.

Yea, i kinda ran out of points before i could get really deep into any of the lines since i thought there was so much nice stuff rather low in them all...but so far i saved a points im planning on spending in "Combat" line... seems most useful to me... right? :p

Well, so much for that idea.. after adding those 13 points (i think i really really need) in "Subtlety" i ran out of points after adding 2 points in kick (which leaves me at 23 points in "Combat") and i was kinda hopeing i would have enough to end up with enough to add a few in Aggression and (and now im just wishing) a few points for Sword Spec. since im planning on getting a sword in my off hand since thats only really there to boost my dmg...



Hope this helps a bit,
Iscariot

Yes, it was very useful... thanx a ton for your time :)

this is what i came up with this time....



Assassination Talents (15 points)


Improved Eviscerate - 3/3 points
Increases the damage done by your Eviscerate ability by 15%.


Malice - 5/5 points
Increases your critical strike chance by 5%.


Murder - 2/2 points
Increases your chance to hit while using your Sap, Ambush, Garrote, or Cheap Shot abilities by 5%.


Lethality - 5/5 points
Increases the critical strike damage bonus of your Sinister Strike, Gouge, Backstab, Ambush, Ghostly Strike, or Hemorrhage ability by 30%.



Combat Talents (23 points)


Lightning Reflexes - 5/5 points
Increases your Dodge chance by 5%.


Improved Backstab - 3/3 points
Increases the critical strike chance of your Backstab ability by 30%.


Deflection - 5/5 points
Increases your Parry chance by 5%.


Riposte - 1/1 point
A strike that becomes active after parrying an opponent's attack. This attack deals 150% weapon damage and disarms the target for 6 seconds.


Improved Evasion - 2/2 points
Increases the effect duration of your Evasion ability by 4 seconds.


Dagger Specialization - 5/5 points
Increases your chance to get a critical strike with Daggers by 5%.


Improved Kick - 2/2 points
Gives your Kick ability a 100% chance to silence the target for 2 seconds.



Subtlety Talents (13 points)


Camouflage - 5/5 points
Increases your speed while stealthed by 15%.


Opportunity - 5/5 points
Increases the damage dealt when striking from behind with your Backstab, Garrote, or Ambush abilities by 20%.


Improved Ambush - 3/3 points
Increases the critical strike chance of your Ambush ability by 40%.

[Iscariot]

I'd still look at Kintoun's sticky post to improve your build. He goes into a lot of detail about each. A good idea would be compare what you've got now to what he's got and find the closest to what you're looking for.

[Filth]

I didnt miss the sticky... really :roll:

/me sneaks away to check out his build

[Filth]

Ok, i been looking tru his templates and his "dagger crit" was the one who got closest to what i want in my build...

Might note that my build is pretty much geared for 1v1 and "ganking"

Lets compare...

His "Assassination Talents"



Improved Eviscerate - 3/3 points
Increases the damage done by your Eviscerate ability by 15%.


Remorseless Attacks - 5/5 points
After killing an opponent that yields experience, gives you a 40% increased critical strike chance on your next Sinister Strike, Backstab, Ambush, or Ghostly Strike.


Malice - 5/5 points
Increases your critical strike chance by 5%.


Ruthlessness - 3/3 points
Gives your finishing moves a 60% chance to add a combo point to your target.


Murder - 2/2 points
Increases your chance to hit while using your Sap, Ambush, Garrote, or Cheap Shot abilities by 5%.


Relentless Strikes - 1/1 point
Your finishing moves have a 20% chance per combo point to restore 25 energy.


Lethality - 5/5 points
Increases the critical strike damage bonus of your Sinister Strike, Gouge, Backstab, Ambush, Ghostly Strike, or Hemorrhage ability by 30%.


Cold Blood - 1/1 point
When activated, increases the critical strike chance of your next Sinister Strike, Backstab, Ambush, or Eviscerate by 100%.


Seal Fate - 5/5 points
Your critical strikes from abilities that add combo points have a 100% chance to add an additional combo point.


Mine...



Improved Eviscerate - 3/3 points
Increases the damage done by your Eviscerate ability by 15%.


Malice - 5/5 points
Increases your critical strike chance by 5%.


Murder - 2/2 points
Increases your chance to hit while using your Sap, Ambush, Garrote, or Cheap Shot abilities by 5%.


Lethality - 5/5 points
Increases the critical strike damage bonus of your Sinister Strike, Gouge, Backstab, Ambush, Ghostly Strike, or Hemorrhage ability by 30%.


Vile Poisons - 5/5 points
Increases the damage dealt by your poisons by 15%.


Cold Blood - 1/1 point
When activated, increases the critical strike chance of your next Sinister Strike, Backstab, Ambush, or Eviscerate by 100%.


We pretty much agree on most parts here... only a few "minor" changes...

I took out "Remorseless Attacks", "Ruthlessness", "Lethality" and "Seal Fate"
and spend 5 points in "Vile Poisons" to get to "Cold Blood" since it actualy seems like a rather cool skill... a question about it tho... Can i pop it while im sneaked and still be able to ambush someone or does it take me out of sneak? either way... its a skill i plan on keeping...

His "Combat Talents"



Improved Gouge - 3/3 points
Increases the effect duration of your Gouge ability by 1.5 seconds.


Improved Sinister Strike - 2/2 points
Reduces the Energy cost of your Sinister Strike ability by 5 Energy.


Improved Backstab - 3/3 points
Increases the critical strike chance of your Backstab ability by 30%.


Mine...



Combat Talents (17 points)


Improved Sinister Strike - 2/2 points
Reduces the Energy cost of your Sinister Strike ability by 5 Energy.


Lightning Reflexes - 5/5 points
Increases your Dodge chance by 5%.


Improved Backstab - 3/3 points
Increases the critical strike chance of your Backstab ability by 30%.


Deflection - 5/5 points
Increases your Parry chance by 5%.


Riposte - 1/1 point
A strike that becomes active after parrying an opponent's attack. This attack deals 150% weapon damage and disarms the target for 6 seconds.


Dagger Specialization - 1/5 point
Increases your chance to get a critical strike with Daggers by 1%.


This is where we start to disagree a bit...

While he took "Improved Gouge", "Improved Sinister Strike" and "Improved Backstab" i took out Gouge and took up a few defensive skills such as "Lightning Reflexes " and "Deflection"...

I also took a few other skills such as "Riposte" and a single point in "Dagger Specialization" for that 1% extra crit... would really have liked all 5% but i guess this is all i get...

On "Subtlety Talents" we agree 100% so i wont bother posting that...

sorry for all the questions but i would really like to get it just perfect :p

-Filth

[Vengeance]

Subtlety Mastery

Camouflage
Rank 5/5
Increases your speed while stealthed by 15%.

Subtlety Total: 5

Combat Mastery

Improved Gouge
Rank 3/3
Increases the effect duration of your Gouge ability by 1.5 secs.

Improved Sinister Strike
Rank 2/2
Reduces the Energy cost of your Sinister Strike ability by 5.

Lightning Reflexes
Rank 5/5
Increases your Dodge chance by 5%.

Deflection
Rank 5/5
Increases your Parry chance by 5%.

Precision
Rank 5/5
Increases your chance to hit with melee weapons by 5%.

Riposte
Rank 1/1
10 Energy 5 yd range
Instant 6 sec cooldown
A strike that becomes active after parrying an opponent's attack. This attack deals 150% weapon damage and disarms the target for 6 sec.

Improved Kick
Rank 2/2
Gives your Kick ability a 100% chance to silence the target for 2 sec.

Dual Wield Specialization
Rank 5/5
Increases the damage done by your offhand weapon by 50%.

Mace Specialization
Rank 5/5
Gives you a 6% chance to stun your target for 3 sec with a mace.

Blade Flurry
Rank 1/1
25 Energy
Instant 2 min cooldown
Requires Melee Weapon
Increases your attack speed by 20%. In addition, attacks strike an additional nearby opponent. Lasts 15 sec.

Aggression
Rank 3/3
Increases the damage of your Sinister Strike and Eviscerate abilities by 6%.

Adrenaline Rush
Rank 1/1
Instant 6 min cooldown
Increases your Energy regeneration rate by 100% for 15 sec.

Combat Total: 38

Assassination Mastery

Improved Eviscerate
Rank 3/3
Increases the damage done by your Eviscerate ability by 15%.

Malice
Rank 5/5
Increases your critical strike chance by 5%.

Assassination Total: 8

Total
Total Points Spent: 51
Level Required: 60

This is my template atm, and I love it.

I am still thinking about switching out Improved Kick for Improved Evasion, as evading is what saves my ass for the most part, and I hardly find that the 2 second silence is worth it (if its not bugged?).

All in all this is by far my favorite Combat heavy temp.

[Filth]

Vengeance > To me it looks like you really missed out on some masive dmg in Subtlety Mastery ... i dont think any rogue would pass on before spending atleast 13 points in there...

[Iscariot]

Vengeance and I have nearly the same build. I have a couple fewer points in Combat, due to Sword Specialization proc not working propery. 31 in Combat for me, and a few in Assassination for Lethality, and a little Remorseless.

I really feel Aggression in Combat is waste of 3 points, and I only have it to get me to Adrenaline Rush. Once they fix Sword Specialization I'll be dropping aggression and reworking my build to fit in Sword Spec.

[Vengeance]

Vengeance > To me it looks like you really missed out on some masive dmg in Subtlety Mastery ... i dont think any rogue would pass on before spending atleast 13 points in there...

Not sure what ya mean.

Being a Combat Heavy mace rogue, I don't really have the points to spend in Subtlety. The only 13 point combo that I can see in it would be maybe Camo / MoD 5/5, Opportunity 5/5, Ghostly Strike 1/1, and and Improved Garrote 2/2. All of these are pretty worthless to me, being a combat rogue, unless I am missing something...

Let me know if I am missing something fairly obvious hehe, because it is definately possible :lol:

[Filth]

Well, i dont know how you are playing your rogue, maybe you dont sneak around as much as i like to do but im using :


Camouflage - 5/5 points
Increases your speed while stealthed by 15%.


Opportunity - 5/5 points
Increases the damage dealt when striking from behind with your Backstab, Garrote, or Ambush abilities by 20%.


Improved Ambush - 3/3 points
Increases the critical strike chance of your Ambush ability by 40%.

But unless you dont sneak up on ppl/mobs a lot its prolly not very useful for ya...

[Vengeance]

Well, i dont know how you are playing your rogue, maybe you dont sneak around as much as i like to do but im using :


Camouflage - 5/5 points
Increases your speed while stealthed by 15%.


Opportunity - 5/5 points
Increases the damage dealt when striking from behind with your Backstab, Garrote, or Ambush abilities by 20%.


Improved Ambush - 3/3 points
Increases the critical strike chance of your Ambush ability by 40%.

But unless you dont sneak up on ppl/mobs a lot its prolly not very useful for ya...

Well, like I said I am a dual mace rogue, so ambush / backstab is kinda useless to me =/

[Filth]

ah, my bad... didnt notice the mace part... how does that work out for ya? been wondering if its any good?