Disillusioned with the Warlock, Nisstyr ?

[Kynn]

So I've got a 60 warlock, one on one with the right pet out, yes, I'm hard to beat though still really learning the class. However, outside of duels I've had trouble finding my niche.

In largescale group pvp, sure I can get my dots off and the occasional nightfall proc SB, but most things die so quickly I find myself being fairly useless.
When we're just out ganking, same thing - I can probably get an SB in or fear off adds, but i'm not doing competent DD or crowd control.

What exactly are we there for? Nisstyr mentioned at one point being the main assist on the warrior, are you dotting or just throwing out shadowbolts? To make a long post shorter, what exactly should our role be in 5v5 pvp, larger scale pvp and smaller scale pvp?

Thanks,

[Jumai]

1) dot EVERYTHING in sight
2) practice using your AE on furballs
3) dark pact every spare moment you get, and every few spells
4) fear lots

I believe Nisstyr uses the succubus for dps without using mana so he can abuse dark pact to the max, since she also has a mez this sounds like an excellent descision to me. The felhound is probably a beast in the right scenarios too.

You will shine in bigger battles. Out ganking is not a 10v10.

[Kynn]

So our role is more like a reverse priest? I mean dots aren't going to do any real DD or killshots with the healer on their side.
We're just dotting everything to get them either lower on health or consume the priests mana but not necessarily an integral part of the fight.

Wouldn't a mage almost always be more valuable then a warlock? I just don't understand how we can be effective in pvp groups. Will the dots laid on people make that big a difference, and even if so, is that really our only pertinent role ?

[Jumai]

No mage can AE as many people for as long as a warlock can DOT. Mages also have to drink or evocation when they're OOM, you shouldn't run out because of dark pact. You also underestimate fear and howl of terror and succubus mez when combined.

A warlock can put a large group of people into information overload, especially the healers. Their DPS is stunning when you start racking up the DOTs on 5-6 people, they have an ae option, and their crowd control is very strong.

[Rekuul']

In small group pvp I usually dont dot everyone, its better to CC them with my pet and hope a mage poly's one.

I have +15% bonus chance to crit on searing pain and its a 1.5 second cast (its also instant damage, no travel time ala bolt spells) so I pretty much spam that on the main target.

Oh and, you should be casting fear like every third spell. Let one person run out of the fight and then fear another. Who to target is very situational so I cant really give advice on that front, but as a general rule I dont atempt to fear warriors because often they have their immunity up. Also, remember to cast howl of terror whenever possible because it is not on the same counter as normal fear. Unless you are getting pounded into the ground you can usually get at least 2 or 3 people feared at once.

-Rek

[Harlan_bagdar]

In small group pvp I usually dont dot everyone, its better to CC them with my pet and hope a mage poly's one.

I have +15% bonus chance to crit on searing pain and its a 1.5 second cast (its also instant damage, no travel time ala bolt spells) so I pretty much spam that on the main target.

Oh and, you should be casting fear like every third spell. Let one person run out of the fight and then fear another. Who to target is very situational so I cant really give advice on that front, but as a general rule I dont atempt to fear warriors because often they have their immunity up. Also, remember to cast howl of terror whenever possible because it is not on the same counter as normal fear. Unless you are getting pounded into the ground you can usually get at least 2 or 3 people feared at once.

-Rek

I thought fear could only be used on one person at a time? Eitherway keep this thread going because i have the same problem , when im in a group my dots seem useless because the enemy dies so fast.

[Kynn]

The arguments mentioned so far have done nothing to alleviate my concerns. What has been suggested thus far is that our DOTs are great for effective damage to a large group. The reality of it is that if you get in range to dot their group you're already dead.

There is absolutly NO instance where a warlock would be preferred over say a competent rogue/warrior or mage.

You want CC? Polymorph.
You want DD? I'd much rather have 1 dead priest than 4 people at full health and a priest low with on mana (if he's dumb, if he's smart he just dispelled it all for like some puny mana cost). Let's face it, slowly doing damage is nice in theory, but it's better to just kill them. Instead of a warlock, grab a rogue and decimate the backline - There is no case where this is not more effective.

Instead of a warlock, grab a mage and instagib someone important on the other side.
Instead of a warlock, how 'bout a warrior to draw agro and give everyone in the party free shots.

I mean come on, the argument so far has been we can rack up damage doing dots to 10 people. 10 people are NEVER in range, and if they are, you're dead. Sure we can dot them, so they run off.... wow. I'd rather they were dead.

[zilch]

Polymorph? That's 1 target. I can keep 2 targets totally locked down in a fight. The debuffs are very nice a shadowpriest and warlock with shadowdebuff is a nice combonation. Also warlocks have a lot more hps than most of the classes in the game plus have some decent survivability with their lifetaps and such. With the current problems with dots and debuffs warlocks are very weak but there's things about dots that have made them really good in past games. You can't run from dots, not to mention they add up very fast especially in a large scale fight. It can mean the difference between that mage aeing your group or that priest getting a heal off on him or himself. There are many arguments for the class in how good it is but there are far more for how bad with the current system of dots and debuffs.

[Da'Grim]

I think Kynn have pointed out a great question here which should be taken with a bit mot consideration and be given a good answer or suggestion from people.

Because really, in PvP focus fire seems the way to go. So why DoT everything around you? When your teammates focus fire on chosen target it while die with or without the dots.

To be honest the class does'nt have that great debuffs.


Is fear and suc mez all a 'lock can contribute to a group fight?